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What do statistics really show?

7
Vote

by user Alex Holowczak

My Maths teacher said at the start of my second piece of Maths coursework this year that "Statistics don't prove anything." I think this goes along with that theory.

After reading a lot of Youkilis v Reyes articles, and seeing statistics used to prove one anothers case as winning, I'm not sure that statistics are the way to go, as I now hope to demonstrate (using baseball as an example).

Hits/Doubles/Triples/HRs (hence batting average)
Reflect Player's ability: Hitting the ball
Does not reflect Player's ability: You might have an division with poor pitchers, the NFC North of MLB Pitching. Lower quality pitchers = these stats increasing.

Walks (hence OBP)
Reflect Player's ability: Patience, leaving a ball missing the plate
Does not reflect Player's ability: Playing against pitchers with low accuracy increases OBP.

RBIs
Reflect Player's ability: Comes through when needed
Does not reflect a Player's ability: He may have a poor hitting team, and hence have no runners to hit in.

SBs
Reflect Player's ability: Good speed, awareness
Does not reflect a Player's ability: A pitcher in control and a catcher with a strong arm reduces the chance of stealing bases.

R
Reflect Player's ability: Good speed, awareness
Does not reflect a Player's ability: A bad team/good pitcher may provent anyone getting around.

It can even be turned around the other way...

Ks
Reflect Player's ability: Quality pitching
Does not reflect a Player's ability: Could be poor batting opposition.

ERA
Reflect Player's ability: Quality pitching
Does not reflect a Player's ability: Could be good/poor batting opposition.

All the statistics above are therefore flawed in some way, admittedly some more severely than others. But I think this shows that a players stats rely not only on the ability of the player, but the ability of the opposition.

Which seems to make sense.

Throwing this into the Youkilis-Reyes argument, I'm not sure stats can be used as persuasive weapons, as they play in separate divisions (separate Leagues for that matter), so can not really be compared in any meaningful way with statistics.

Taking this idea further, comparing players of different eras is even harder to do, as different opposition may make it easy to club 500HRs in a career in one era, but struggle to get to 200HRs in a different era.

This makes sense too, as pitching statistics are better in some eras than others.

So as for Youkilis v Reyes, I think everyone should agree to disagree, they are both great players.

N.B. Although if you could disect stats to see matchups against each pitcher, and compare them then, then you could get somewhere (hence, playing in the same division would help for comparison).


Date

Sat 06/24/06, 8:20 am EST


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EstebistecVarsity
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
Actually, to be specific, what most people call statistics in sports are really "observations". Statistics are computed quantities (like a "mean", or "average"). ERA and WHIP are statistics, while RBIs and HRs are observations. Anyway, I don't agree with the idea that they "are not the way" to go in arguments as an absolute. With numeric observations and statistics it is always about context. An observation always just tells you something about the past. A statistic usually does too. People tend to hope that they can make a conclusion about the future from a computed statistic, but that's not always true. I recommend Baseball Prospectus. Dirt cheap and an authoritative guide to what observations and statistics actually help predict things about teams and players for upcoming seasons. Football Prospectus is a much younger effort at doing the same thing for American Football, based on the work at www.footballoutsiders.com. As it turns out, it's MUCH harder to see exactly what's going on in a football game when it's always 11 vs. 11 as opposed to a pitcher vs. a batter and then maybe fielding. The raw observations of yards gained by a team is even more deceiving than any of the observations you can take from baseball, at least within the context of one football game.
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Alex HolowczakHall of Famer
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
What actually is WHIP? I've seen it a few times and don't know what it means.
Permalink
EstebistecVarsity
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
WHIP is Walks + Hits per inning pitched.
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Alex HolowczakHall of Famer
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
Thanks.
Permalink
Bball3345Draft Pick
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
That is why you compare a player's production to those around him. Youkilis has a much higher OBP than almost everyone in the AL; whereas, Reyes ranks nowhere near the top. OBP measures how many times a player gets on base, and the more times someone is on base, the more times they will score. You cannot use runs, because that is too heavily dependent on the teammates. As Estebistec mentioned about Baseball Prospectus, there are in fact ways to compare player's across divisions, leagues, and eras. Statistics do prove things, because they are the recording of what actually happened. Simply watching a player or team relies on human perception, which will often make patterns where there are none.
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Bball3345Draft Pick
1285 days ago
Score 0+-
By the way, I think with Reyes playing SS and taking a step forward this year, as well as Youkilis at a much more offensive-minded position, they are almost equal in value to each of their respective teams.
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Alex HolowczakHall of Famer
1285 days ago
Score -1+-
That's a great point - there are not many great offensive SS whereas there are a host of 1B that are great.
Permalink
Anonymous Fanatic #1
1285 days ago
Score -2+-
maths!
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Anonymous Fanatic #2
1281 days ago
Score 0+-
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