Tom Brady is overrated

There is nothing wrong with having a bunch of Pats fans hate you, because really who cares about Beantown. However, I will agree with you to a degree on this. Brady is nothing special in regards to the fact he wont outthrow everyone in the league. He isnt the fastest or the most gifted. He is perhaps the most intellegent outside of Peyton. He is also probably the most composed QB in the league. If you have those qualities and you get put on a good team with a good scheme then you can become a great QB.

Fantasy teams and real life teams have nothing to do with eachother. The article is pretty good up until you made that statement, then it just sounded really bad.

Brady has been helped out greatly by playing for a Hall of Fame defensive-minded coach. With that siad, Brady does have 3 Super Bowl rings. For that alone, Brady will make it into the Hall of Fame. So, in some ways. Brady is not over-rated. Hence, it is what he is. And many who are reading this comment must be asking themselves WTF does he mean. :)

Oddly enough I could follow your logic on that statment

I defer to False Prophet but...

Tom Brady is not average...average QBs don't win 3 super bowls...

The Pats O-line gets tons of love...you just haven't heard it...when was the last time you heard someone go out of their way to talk about some good QB's o-line...happens about as much with the pats as any other good team

The Media didn't coin Brady as cool, Brady did...he's lead numerous game winning drives...and won 3 super bowls doing so

If Troy Brown or David Patton is more responsible for a Super Bowl ring than brady, i'll eat my hat...that's bull

Vintieri didn't single handedly win those super bowls...heck Brady put him in position

Finally, Peyton Manning will admit this too, football is a team game...a good QB is a result of a good team and very few players, expecially in football ever outshine their team or can win games by themselves (never in football).

Let's examine the talent around him on the offensive side of the ball courtesy of profootballreference.com. Here is the list of pro bowl players he has played with. 2001- Troy Brown, 2002- none, 2003- none, 2004- Corey Dillon, 2005- none, 2006- none.

Yeah, uh, don't you think that they should be talking about the TEAM in addition to Brady? and jutmsy4, I said he's an average Qb when he's under pressure, like any other Qb in the league, he is human you know!

Also, What has Brady done the last 2 years? Get owned by Indianapolis?

I'm a seahawks fan and I can't stand the Pats. Just to prove i'm a hawks fan, think back to 2 years ago, Hawks 42 Eagles 0.

I voted for this article just on the basis of the title.

I'm going to try and take this one step at a time instead of saying "you're an idiot, Tom Brady is godlike, I hate you."

#1 - His offensive line does all the work, and when they don't do their job, Tom Brady is an average quarterback. Tom Brady's poise in the pocket is quite remarkable. In addition, when your left tackle is out of commission for the whole year (2005) it is tough to maneuver around. I believe Brady did the best that can be expected with what he had that year. As a Pats fan, I actually think that the o-line for the Pats is a bit OVER-rated, especially in pass blocking, because of Brady's excellent poise.

#2 - He doesn't have a cannon for an arm, and when his receivers catch a 2 yard pass, and turn it into a 40 yard gain, Brady gets all the credit. The curl, screen, and hitch routes are in every playbook, and all quarterbacks get credit when their receivers do this. In addition, I agree that while Brady has no cannon, players like Byron Leftwich and Kyle Boller DO have cannons and cannot even come close to doing what Brady can do.

#3 - The media coins Brady as cool, calm, and collected. Maybe in down to the wire situations, but if a call doesn't go his way, or the Patriots are getting the snot kicked out of them, he loses his cool and yells at his teammates! That's his leadership style. He motivates his team by yelling them into shape, just as Peyton Manning leads his team by giving a pat on the back. Both styles have clearly worked.

#4 - Troy Brown, David Patten, and the entire offensive line get zero credit. Heck, Adam Vinateri won 2 out of 3 titles on a last second field goal. I would say quite the contrary. At least among Patriots fans, Troy Brown and the offensive line get a LOT of credit. As for David Patten, what has he done since leaving New England? He was a product of Brady's arm and nothing else. In addition, I don't see how Vinatieri kicking a field goal to end those Super Bowl drives has any negative stigma towards Brady's skill as a leader. He was the one who had to do the time management and play calling during the two minute drills that were the ends of all of those games. If a field goal is the right strategy, it's the right strategy.

#5 - Or who I would want on my fantasy team, I'd pick Peyton Manning over Brady. As would I, his stats are more consistent. However, fantasy teams are not real teams, and both quarterbacks have shown the capability to manage their teams well in their own way.

I think that covers it.

Since 2001 Pats are 3-2 regular season and 2-1 post season vs. the Colts.

The thing that I love about Brady is that he gets touchdowns when he really needs them. OK, he has three rings, that's one thing, but putting that aside, being a Pats fan, I should know that Brady is clutch and makes great passes and gets touchdowns when the team needs them. For instance, in the playoffs, They're down by two touchdowns and the Pats are on their last play before the second half is over. You know that Brady is going to somehow make that play. That is what he's known for, which makes him a good quarterback. I'm not saying he's great... yet, but when you're what? 11-3 or 4 in your career in the playoffs, you know you're doing something right.

You realize that after Charlie Weis left, The Pats haven't won a super bowl ring? Also, why did they lose in the playoffs? The Broncos and Colts eventually hassled Brady, and forced him into turnovers.

Hey, read the 2nd sentence, I said Brady was good not great, I never said he was a bad QB.

I was going to bring up Brady's name in the Most Overrated list we had a couple days ago, but then I did some research and found some very interesting material: In his first 7 seasons in the NFL, Brady has 147 touchdown passes to 78 INTs, or almost a 2:1 ratio. Joe Montana over his career threw 273 touchdowns vs. 139 INTs, or almost a 2:1 ratio. Dan Marino threw 420 touchdowns to 252 INTs. John Elway? 300 vs. 226. Brett Favre? 414 vs. 273. Peyton Manning over nine season has 275 touchdowns and 139 INTs, or almost a 2:1 ratio. Montana played 15 seasons and amassed 40,551 yards passing. Brady, after seven, has 21,564 yards passing, well on his way to the 40,000 mark.

I never look at Super Bowl rings to determine a quarterback's greatness, after all, Trent Dilfer has one, and Rex Grossman could've had one. Even Bart Starr, who won two, threw nine touchdowns vs. 17 interceptions during the Packers' run to a win in Super Bowl II.

But as far as pure stats go, if Brady keeps up his pace, he'll be among the greats. The three rings are just icing on the cake.

Brady conquering Giselle > Brady winning Super Bowls

Brady overrated! I would love to see P Manning throw to Caldwell and Gaffney and still make it into the AFC Championship game. He is grossly underrated if you ask me!

QBs are all overated. Brady is the PERFECT example. It's great that NFL isn't like NBA, but it appears as though people are lining up to make it such. Here's an analogy that will make ya think: Vick = Kobe.

PS. Peyton Manning is wicked awesome on the field, AND he's got a whole comedy acting career ahead of him. Maybe he'll come to the Second City eventually?

Saying that Brady is average when his offensive line doesn't do their job isn't a knock on him - what quarterback wouldn't be average, or worse, when his offensive line holds for a fraction of a second?

No shit.

80-25 regular season, 10 straight post season wins at one point (record, 21 game winning streak including postseason (record). The guy wins championships, isnt that the point to win.

Youngest quarterback to win 3 superbowls. Not Great? Jealousy is not great either!

WHO EVER SAYS BRADY ISNT AWESOME IS AN IDIOT. HI IDIOT,NICE TO MEET YOU.

[http://www.a..._Papi_rated_"JUST_RIGHT" maybe Tom Brady is rated "Just Right"?

I have to say the one who started this thread is a moron and obviously a manning fan, so I have to questions for this idiot:

question 1):

In playoff, against well matched defense, can you think of a great QB who wouldve struggled like Peyton Manning to put on lousy 20 pts, with Harrison and Wayne?

NO. YOU CANT.

Dont shamelessly use 2006 playoff as example, in two games against KC and Bears, Colts defense dominated opponents and Colts offense stayed on field like 38 and 39 minutes.

and except one game against Colts (20-3), pats didnt have much advantage in time possession, like in 41-27 win over Steelers, our offense had less than 30 minutes on field.

Question (2):

In playoff, against well matched defnese, How many pts do you think Colts offense would be able to put on without EITHER Harrison OR Wayne?

NO MORE THAN 17 pts.

If without Harrison AND Wayne, Colts offense wouldnt even put 14 pts

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Bulger or Brady Score: 27 -

edals61

Reputation: 1 Level: Amateur Since: Jul 31, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 1:39 am Is this a serious question??? As far as the numbers go, just throw them out the window, numbers tend to not tell the whole truth. Here's my question. If you had to chose Brady or Bulger to win one game to be played tonight, tommorow or the next day who would it be? Right Brady, Brady and oh yeah Brady

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Bulger or Brady Score: 90 -

justifygame

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July 31, 2007 11:46 am I would choose Bulger. He passed 4301 yards and still managed a 91.3 passer rating. He had one of the fewest (if not the fewest, i have to check again) ints in the league. While brady passed 3529 with a 87 passer rating. Someone said bulger only did so well because of scott linehan, i was argue that Mike Martz was wayyy better. People also argue that brady has more wins and superbowls. So what? Thats not because of brady, thats because of the team, which also includes a defense, which the Rams do not have. People are also saying bulger has WRs, so did brady until last yr. Donte Stallworth is one of my favorite receivers because of his speed, and on top of that brady now has Randy Moss. in my opinion, brady now has the best receivers in the nfl, and if he still doesn't get a season better than bulger season this yr, then its easy to see who is better.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 89 -

justifygame

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July 31, 2007 11:55 am edals61, you cant win with a qb alone. thats only one man. u need a team for that qb. your pointing out the fact that brady gets wins. thats because his team also plays well. if you had to choose brady or bulger on a bad team like the Lions, i would want bulger because he is the better qb. bulger has a bad offensive line, still he played well. his team always allowed tds, but he would always try to come back with a td of his own. i also watched him play when bruce n holt were injured, and he still played well.

you should change your questions to if you had to choose a TEAM to get wins, and then answer i would choose the Patriots.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 32 -

SupRSteele

Reputation: 20 Level: Amateur Since: Jul 19, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 1:15 pm I'd still have to say Brady. Bulger better show something for getting that kind of ink...maybe that will drive him to do it..but he's had some really bad years lately.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 95 -

liz1663

Reputation: 97 Level: Superstar Since: Nov 2, 2006 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 1:58 pm

I would choose Bulger. He passed 4301 yards and still managed a 91.3 passer rating. He had one of the fewest (if not the fewest, i have to check again) ints in the league. While brady passed 3529 with a 87 passer rating. Someone said bulger only did so well because of scott linehan, i was argue that Mike Martz was wayyy better. People also argue that brady has more wins and superbowls. So what? Thats not because of brady, thats because of the team, which also includes a defense, which the Rams do not have. People are also saying bulger has WRs, so did brady until last yr.

justifygame,

I have to disagree with you on this one... I know Bulger has more yds and fewer ints than Brady last year but you have to account who Bradys recievers were last year... Caldwell was hes leading reciever but he was never a starter in San Diego and Jabbar was signed off the streets in the middle of the season while Bulger still have Bruce and all pro Torry Holt....

The year before (05) when Brady have Branch and Givens as he go two guys, Brady threw for 4,110 yds, 26 tds and 14 ints while Bulger threw for 2297 yds 14 tds and 9 ints,so last year even though Brady has to work with those new recievers, he still put up good numbers close to Bulgers....Bulger has 24 tds and 8 ints while Brady has 24 tds and 12 ints but lead hes team to the AFC championship game....

Yeah, Brady has more wins b/c of our team but I believe that there is no QB out there that can win a game by himself without the help of his team,besides Bulger have all pro lineman in Orlando Pace while Brady have no all pro lineman...

I still say that Bulger is a very good QB but I will take Brady over Bulger b/c Ive seen Brady performs at pressure times and he proved that he can do it, so until I see Bulger carry hes team to the next level than maybe I'll change my opinion but as of right now I have to say Brady gets the nod over Bulger.....

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Bulger or Brady Score: 70 -

Armey_vet

Reputation: 86 Level: All-Star Since: May 1, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 3:40 pm

Tom Brady has nothing to prove because he has three NFL championship rings- and counting. No other QB in football can say this, not even NFL poster boy Peyton Manning. I'm not dissing Marc Bulger, but there is no comparison here. Absolutely none.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 86 -

zt0a

Reputation: 89 Level: All-Star Since: Aug 26, 2006 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 7:16 pm

edals61, you cant win with a qb alone. thats only one man. u need a team for that qb. your pointing out the fact that brady gets wins. thats because his team also plays well. if you had to choose brady or bulger on a bad team like the Lions, i would want bulger because he is the better qb. bulger has a bad offensive line, still he played well. his team always allowed tds, but he would always try to come back with a td of his own. i also watched him play when bruce n holt were injured, and he still played well.

you should change your questions to if you had to choose a TEAM to get wins, and then answer i would choose the Patriots

In 2005 season, brady didnt get help from his defense, he had one of the worst running games in the league. his offense stayed on field average 30:50 in 15 games he played. his offense produced over 375 pts.

In 2006 season, he had one of the worst offensive corp in the league and still got 87 QBR, and still managed staying on field 31+ min and 375+pts

My question to you is:

What more can you expect from a QB?

By the way, you were talking about playing for Lions. I remembered that in 2000 season, manning WITH Harrison in a weak team, his team went 6-10. so What is the point of judging a QB in a HOPELESS team?

Why cant you answer my two questions on the top of this page? Do you have answers?

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Bulger or Brady Score: 82 -

GimmeThePats

Reputation: 84 Level: All-Star Since: Mar 26, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

July 31, 2007 10:50 pm Wanna talk about numbers?

16 years in the NFL, Dan Marino has the highest TD to INT differential and 61'000+ yards passing...

15 years in the NFL, Joe Montana has a lower TD to INT differential and just over 40'000 yards passing...

13 years in the NFL, Steve Young has 33'000 yards passing...

Funny that... because last time I looked, Steve Young and Joe Montana collectively had racked up 5 SBs... How many does desperate Dan have?

Bulger is just having a good year at the hands of a good offense, much like Warner did in 1999 and 2001...

Brady has endured many team changes since 2001 and still has the highest winning percentage in the NFL and more rings than any other QB currently active in the NFL...

There's no comparison... it's Brady

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Bulger or Brady Score: 28 -

vikings4l1fe

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July 31, 2007 11:01 pm oh i would have to go with Tom Brady becuase he has a new WR of course my favorite Randy Moss. he also has donte stallworth. but Marc Bulger is good and has Torry Holt and and Drew Bennett i think tom will do better so i would go with tom becuase marc has to give the ball to Steven Jackson one other the top RB's this year and then Laurence Maroney he will get a few but not as muhc as steven jackson becuase he has alot to prove this year so i would sticck to tom

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Bulger or Brady Score: 49 -

XLIParrothead

Reputation: 46 Level: Rookie Since: Jul 1, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

August 1, 2007 12:31 am

I believe the question in this thread is about Bulger vs. Brady. Why do certain 'fans' have to turn it into a debate between Brady and Manning?

We've heard it all before. Cases can be made for both, and I think we're all sick of hearing the same recycled stats to try and prove which is better.

They're both great. Get over it.

(BTW...if anyone said that Bulger is better than Brady, they should be shot in the face.)

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Bulger or Brady Score: 55 -

BleedBlu871

Reputation: 52 Level: Pro Since: Jun 26, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

August 1, 2007 2:54 am "<a href="../../../nfl/players/playerpage/187741">Tom Brady has nothing to prove because he has three NFL championship rings- and counting. No other QB in football can say this, not even NFL poster boy <a href="../../../nfl/players/playerpage/12531">Peyton Manning. I'm not dissing <a href="../../../nfl/players/playerpage/187501">Marc Bulger, but there is no comparison here. Absolutely none."

Armey please think before you speak. This reference above is the biggest joke that is thrown around time after time by illogical Pats fans. DUDE Kevin Faulk has 3 rings too so he's the go to guy over Ladanian Tomlinson (who has no rings), over Larry Johnson (who has no rings), over Steven Jackson... Shaun Alexander... etc.... You see my point?? When will you people realize that a Superbowl is a TEAM accomplishment.

ZtoA do you have that much of a hard on for Manning that whenever Brady's name is brought up you have to throw Manning in with him? The logic that your leaving out is in the same way with Manning, without the help of his team Brady cannot and will not be able to win on his own. He proved that in 05' when he had to carry the team on his back (10-6 record and bounced from the playoffs). Manning has proved that for that last 6 years that he CANNOT win the game on his own. It takes a collective effort. Bulger is seeing the EXACT same thing now. His offense is top tiered but his defense is garbage. Once they get a defense similar to that of what Warner had, there is no doubt in my mind Bulger can take them to the promise land.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 85 -

Armey_vet

Reputation: 86 Level: All-Star Since: May 1, 2007 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

August 1, 2007 12:59 pm

No- I don't see your point.

I thought that this thread was regarding Tom Brady and Marc Bulger.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 86 -

zt0a

Reputation: 89 Level: All-Star Since: Aug 26, 2006 Want to Add to Favorites? Sign in

August 1, 2007 6:39 pm

ZtoA do you have that much of a hard on for Manning that whenever Brady's name is brought up you have to throw Manning in with him? The logic that your leaving out is in the same way with Manning, without the help of his team Brady cannot and will not be able to win on his own. He proved that in 05' when he had to carry the team on his back (10-6 record and bounced from the playoffs). Manning has proved that for that last 6 years that he CANNOT win the game on his own. It takes a collective effort. Bulger is seeing the EXACT same thing now. His offense is top tiered but his defense is garbage. Once they get a defense similar to that of what Warner had, there is no doubt in my mind Bulger can take them to the promise land.

No, when there is a thread about brady, there are ALWAYS some shameless Manning fans jumping in and claimig how brady has benefited from his team.

what do you mean by "without the help of his team Brady cannot and will not be able to win on his own."? Did I ever deny that? no, I NEVER did!! No pats fans did! On the other hand, there are bunch of brainless manning fans who believe Manning got his QBR by himself , like the fool who started this thread. My questions are for them.

Whether you like it or not, 2006 season proved that without great WR, Manning wouldnt win anything in playoff, EVEN HE HAD TOP DEFENSE!

put Brady in Lions, what will be Lions record? I am 100% sure they would be better than 6-10. Why? because in 2005 season, Brady's offense produced 375 pts and stayed on field over 30:30 min a game. so here comes another question to some shameless manning fans who have discredited Brady over 3 years:

Name a team, whose offense produced over 350+ pts and stayed on field over 30 min a game, had a record worse than 6-10.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 87 -

zt0a

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August 1, 2007 6:46 pm

He proved that in 05' when he had to carry the team on his back (10-6 record and bounced from the playoffs).

Are you talking about 2005 or 2002? he didnt carry the team in either of them.

He had running game, Harrison and top 10 defense in 2002.

He struggled like below average QB in first month of 2005 season, and his mistake led Colts first loss to Chargers.

The only season he had to carry the team was 2001 season (or 2000 season?), when Colts had a 6-10 record.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 55 -

XLIParrothead

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August 1, 2007 7:32 pm Hey guys...He's still doing it.

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Bulger or Brady Score: 64 -

lions_313

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August 1, 2007 7:45 pm

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!?!?!

THIS IS REALLY A QUESTION?

BULGER GOT A BIG CONTRACT YAY FOR HIM BUT UHHHH Kurt Warner WAS A BETTER QB FOR ST LOUIS

I AM BY NOOOOOOOO MEANS A BRADY FAN EVEN THOUGH I'M A MICHIGAN MAN I JUST DON'T LIKE THE GUY BUT HE IS BY FAR BETTER THAN BULGER

ACTUALLY I'M ANNOYED I EVEN TOOK THE TIME TO RESPOND TO THIS NONSENSE

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Bottom line: On the final drive, if the score is 3 pts or less, I'd trust Brady to lead the offense down the field for a field goal. 4 pts or more then forget it. I have yet to see Tom Brady lead his team on a final TD drive (check out the AFC championship game last year against the Colts if you need proof)

You're absolutely right. Tom Brady always gets all the credit for what he does, but I think that goes for any other quarterback too. Montana, Elway, even Peyton Manning. Does anyone know who Teddy Bruschi is? Quite a few Patriots "fans" don't know who anyone on the Pats roster is except Tom Brady, which is sad because they've got a hell of a good team. Why do you think they're always in the playoffs? It's not always because of Tom Brady (even though he is very clutch and can get a touchdown with a minute left in the game), but because of everyone else who is backing him up. Good point, SSReporters, and I'm a Pats fan, and I'm not mad at you because you make a good point.