armchairgm
all sports, all you
+ Add Friends
You are not logged-in.
Sign Up - Log In
Main Page
Sports
Write
Articles
Hot Links
Images
Meet People
Fun
Explore
MLB - NFL - NBA - NHL - College Basketball - College Football - Soccer - Nascar - Other
Article - Locker Room Discussion
All Articles - New Articles - Today's Articles
Submit a Link - Approve Links
Picture Game - Ratings - Polls - Pick Game - Quiz Game - Spring Silliness
Random Page - Random Image - Random Fan
Edit
Page history Discuss pageWhat links here

Re-visiting the Cy Young award talk

18
Vote

by TehLoki

As we near the stretch of the season, it's time to look at our Cy Young hopefuls. I'm picking out what I believe are the top 3 at this point. You can post anyone else you believe in comments.

National League

Jake Peavy, SD (18-6 2.39 ERA 225 K's)
Brad Penny, LAD (16-4 2.88 ERA 131 K's)
Brandon Webb, ARI ( 16-10 2.99 ERA 184 K's)

I was going to include Chris Young, but his numbers aren't overly impressive although his 2.77 ERA is nice, a 9-7 record isn't. Cole Hamels has a 14-5 record but a 3.50 ERA plus he's just coming back. Peavy's proving to be one of the tops in the MLB. He's kept his team in games and will carry them to the playoffs, so they hope. His ERA is tops in the NL, as are his 225 K's. Teams are hitting a .204 on Peavy.

Brad Penny is also having an amazing year, 16-4? His previous 3 years he is 16-19, but his ERA is higher and K's are lower. Hitters are hitting .252 against Penny. Right hitters though, are hitting .285.

Brandon Webb, our previous champ, is having another great year, but his losses and ERA are higher with less K's. Hitters are hitting .230 against Webb, which is better than Penny's, lefties are hitting .267 off webb.

Peavy gets this choice.

American League

Josh Beckett BOS (19-6 3.20 ERA 180 K's)
Fausto Carmona CLE (17-8 3.07 ERA 126 K's)
C.C. Sabathia CLE (17-7 3.21 ERA 198 K's)

The AL was much harder to choose from with guys like Johan Santana, Erik Bedard and Chien-Ming Wang, but I've seen a bit more of these 3. Like I said, you can disagree with me, but make sure you post in your comment of who and why.

Here in the AL, my original pick was Beckett, as stated in my first article early in the season. He's the first 19 game winner this year, and he's been a constant threat every game. His ERA is 2nd in the AL and he ranks in the top 10 in K's. Hitters are hitting a mere .241 in the high octane AL.

Fausto Carmona: Before this season, I had no idea who he was. Well, he made quick work of that, he quickly and quietly, behind Sabathia, became one of my favorite pitchers. His ERA is 1st in the AL, although he ranks low in the K's his ERA and record show he doesn't need to strikeout everyone to win. Hitters are hitting .245 against him .004 points higher than Beckett which is very impressive from the 2nd year starter.

C.C. Sabathia, whom I was hounded for not including early on, did indeed prove me wrong. #6 in ERA, top 10 in wins and 4th in K's. Very Cy Young like numbers. He's proving to be a top flight pitcher when healthy. Hitters are hitting a .241 against him, with lefties being the problem; well "problem" hitting .276.

It's a tight race in the AL, with all 3 very good picks, but I'm staying my course with Josh Beckett. He's too dominant to ignore.

Jake Peavy for the NL and Josh Beckett for the AL.

As always, I would love to see if you agree or disagree. All I ask, again, is if you disagree say who you'd choose and why.


Enable Comment Auto-Refresher
TehLokiVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Someone fix my title please, haha it's Re-Visiting Damnit
Permalink | Reply
BigPPupMajor Leaguer
802 days ago
Score 1+-
fixed
Permalink
TehLokiVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Thanks!
Permalink
WoodsmeisterVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Beckett will win because he pitches for Boston and because he has more wins.
Permalink | Reply
Falcon02520Legend
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Its not because he pitches for Boston, its because he has wins and strikeouts combined with a good era.
Permalink
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 3+-
Good article. I don't think that there's a doubt in anyone's mind that Jake Peavy is going to be the Cy Young award winner. Look at his stats. He leads the NL in wins, strikeouts, and ERA. Can't get any better than that. As for the AL, my pick was Erik Bedard, but he's out now, so he's probably out of the picture. So, I'm going to have to say Josh Beckett. If he's a 20 game winner, it's the envelope is sealed, so to speak. I agree with you, he has definitely carried the Red Sox to where they are right now. If it wasn't for him, the Red Sox have this much of a lead, or maybe none at all. Good picks, and I agree with you.
Permalink | Reply
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 3+-
Let's not forget to recognize Brad Penny though. Even though Jake Peavy leads the NL in strikeouts, wins, and ERA, Brad Penny has still put some impressive numbers on the board. He's 16-4 (2nd in wins this year), 3rd in ERA with 2.88, and has 131 K's (not an impressive number but I'm throwing it in anyway). Also, he has the highest winning percentage for a pitcher (.800), and with a team that has been struggling on offense all year, except maybe for this month, I think it's safe to say that an .800 winning percentage with the 2007 Dodgers is pretty impressive.
Permalink
TehLokiVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 1+-
I agree, Penny has been superb, which is why i threw out his record over the past 3 years compared to this year. 15 less losses and the same amount of wins. It's amazing how he made such a turn around.
Permalink
JimmurroSoccer Kid
802 days ago
Score 1+-
Brady Penny's teammate Takashi Saito should be included.
Permalink
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 1+-
1.21 ERA (pretty impressive), 0.704 WHIP (very impressive), 39 saves out of 42 opportunities (impressive). Yes, you're right. He should be included, but he's not even close to winning.
Permalink
SashaDiv-I Stud
802 days ago
Score 1+-
You include Satio I want Valverde up too.
Permalink
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 1+-
Saito: 39 saves out of 42 (3 blown saves), 1.21 ERA, 0.704 WHIP

Valverde: 45 saves out of 52 (7 blown saves), 2.79 ERA, 1.109 WHIP

I'll take Saito, thank you very much. Relievers shouldn't be included unless they have really great seasons. Saito has done good, and should be included in the conversation as a pitcher who has done really well this (which is what I meant), but Valverde shouldn't be included in Cy Young talk at ALL! Saito should get 3-4 points, tops.
Permalink
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Actually 2 votes tops, both points are from 3 place votes.
Permalink
Simms1156Div-I Stud
802 days ago
Score 0+-
He made a turn around? uh-oh, he must be on steroids too. (sarcasm)
Permalink | Reply
KelsdadAll-Star
802 days ago
Score 3+-
Closers should not be considered for Cy Young, unless there is no legitimate candidate among the starters. And even at that he has to have a stupid ridiculous season like Eckersley had in '88.
Permalink | Reply
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Or Eric Gagne in 2003, where he saved (second most ever in a season) 55 games out of 55 with a 1.20 ERA and a .692 WHIP.

I think Jason Schmidt OR Eric Gagne should've won it. Either way, you should still include relievers. Eric Gagne probably had the best season ever for a closer in 2003, which is why he got 28 out of 32 first place votes.

You're right, it IS stupid to have a reliever win the Cy Young award, but if a closer is doing that good and there's no other starter that stands out that much, I'll take the closer.
Permalink
Manny StilesMajor Leaguer
801 days ago
Score 0+-
or Mark Davis in '89?? (tee hee)
Permalink
Anonymous Fanatic #1
802 days ago
Score -2+-
Sabathia gets the nods in my eyes for a couple of reasons. I will put together a piece on this in the next couple of days and post it. But in six of Sabathia's seven losses this season, the Indians have scored two runs or less. Until last Friday, he had nineteen straight quality starts. Sabathia is the Cy Young winner for me.
Permalink | Reply
KelsdadAll-Star
802 days ago
Score -1+-
You're the only one, I'm afraid. Beckett will win it, and it may be unanimous.
Permalink | Reply
RomiezzoLegend
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Probably. And it's mainly cuz he's probably going to get that 20th win. There isn't really anything that a pitcher has (that's good) that Beckett doesn't. Leader in wins with 19, a 3.20 ERA (pretty good), 180 K's, 4th in WHIP with 1.129, 3rd to K/BB (4.74). Pretty good. That's why I said he'd win it. No one in the AL (as of now) can really beats that.
Permalink
Silencer76AAA-er
802 days ago
Score 1+-
In the AL I still think that Kelvim Escobar should be considered and in the NL, Ted Lilly and Aaron Harang. We want to talk about Penny and his winning percentage on the Dodgers...Harang is 15-4 with a 3.65 ERA playing for the Reds in that bandbox of a ballpark in Cincinnati.
Permalink
KelsdadAll-Star
802 days ago
Score 1+-
That's a great point Silencer, and I thought Harang should have won it last year.
Permalink | Reply
Silencer76AAA-er
802 days ago
Score 3+-
couple more numbers on Harang this year...he has thrown 209.2 innings, allowed just 188 hits, and has solid control, as evidenced by his 192:49 K:BB ratio. He does seem susceptible to the long ball (25), but who wouldn't be making half your starts there?

His WHIP is 1.13 which is 4th in the NL, 2nd in win %, 6th in W, 4 in BB/9 at 2.10, 7th in K/9 at 8.24, 3rd in innings, 2nd in Ks, and 4th in K:BB with a 3.92:1 ratio.

On top of that, I have to deal with the Cubs facing him twice down the stretch. He would get my vote hands down over ANY of the other contenders.
Permalink
Manny StilesMajor Leaguer
802 days ago
Score 0+-
word.
Permalink
KelsdadAll-Star
802 days ago
Score 0+-
The Cy Young winner last season had 16 wins, as did Harang. If he does beat the Cubs at least once or twice coming in, and the Cubs don't make the postseason, then the vote could sway Harang's way. Alot of people are still ticked off Webb won last year so its possible he could get some sympathy votes as well. Good point, Silencer, and nice numbers, I'd plus you more if I could. Nice job.
Permalink | Reply
MoPrekiWaterboy
802 days ago
Score 1+-
Jake Peavy should and will win the NL CY Young simply because he leads in the triple crown stats, and hes been the most dominant pitcher in the NL.

As for the AL, I think that CC Sabathia should win it. He has been incredible all season long. His record shows nothing of his dominance. From July 24 - September 8, he had a stretch of 10 starst where he gave up 2 runs or less in 6 innings or more ( he went 6 innings twice, 7 + for the rest). His record in that incredible stretch was 4-3. 4-3!! You dont pitch 10 straight dominant games and have only 4 wins to show for it! A reallistic total would be 7-1 for such a stretch. Do the math and that gives him a 20-5 record. He has been the most dominant pitcher. As for Beckett, he has been great and I think he should get the comeback player of the year( people forget about his past year). Sabathia though, hes been too much.

As a side note... I know that closers get no love in the Cy Young race, but you have to give JJ Putz at least a handfull of votes. 38/40 in saves. 4-1 with a 1.37 ERA. Thats Cy Young material
Permalink | Reply
WoodsmeisterVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Escobar is pitching himself out of the Cy Young race.

As I said earlier, I think Beckett wins it because he pitches for Boston and gets all the publicity. Unfortunately, that's the only reason Beckett wins, because on a strict reading of the full set of statistics, I think Sabathia would get the nod. Let's do a comparison of the two:

CC Sabathia: 227 innings pitched (first in AL); 17 wins (tied for 3rd), ERA - 3.21; Complete Games - 4 (2nd); K's - 198 (4th); WHIP - 1.15; K/BB: 5.66; Shutouts - 1; VORP - 61.3 (1st); PRC - 124 (2nd); ERA+ - 138 (6th); Run support - 5.63

Beckett - 188.2 innings pitched (18th in AL); 19 wins (1st); ERA - 3.20; Complete games - 1; Ks - 180 (8th); WHIP 1.13; K/BB - 4.74; Shutouts - 0; VORP - 56.8 (4th); PRC - 114 (3rd - tie); ERA+ - 144 (1st); Run Support - 6.73

When you look at the full package of statistics, it's hardly a landslide for Beckett. He has two more wins, but Sabathia has been pitching deeper into games, their ERA is statistically indistinguishable, as is their WHIP. Sabathia has an even better K/BB rate than Beckett, and has won 17 games while receiving over a run less per game in support than Beckett. Sabathia also does better in most of the Sabermetrics.
Permalink | Reply
Bball3345Draft Pick
802 days ago
Score 0+-
I wrote an article on the Cy Young race a little while back, and I picked Johan Santana. As of today, I still think Santana is the most deserving starter because of his dominance in Ks. However, if I voted today, my 1st place vote would go to J.J. Putz. I rarely think a reliever deserves a Cy Young, but Putz has pitched in clutch situations all year; he hasn't been earning cheap saves. This is seen by his WPA (Win Probability Added) of 5.50, higher than any pitcher in any league. Putz has been unhittable all year and I think this is the rare case where no starter established themselves as having a truly great season, while Putz is having a special season.
Permalink | Reply
WoodsmeisterVarsity Captain
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Oh, so now WPA is your top statistic for determining the CY? What will it be next week?
Permalink
Bball3345Draft Pick
802 days ago
Score 0+-
Give me a break... I was using WPA to show that Putz wasn't just piling up saves and Ks in non-pressure situations. I don't think there is any one stat that definitively proves who should be the Cy Young. However, when comparing starters, I think it is best to use RA and Ks. When comparing starters to relievers it gets trickier.
Permalink
WoodsmeisterVarsity Captain
801 days ago
Score 0+-
Be consistent, and I'll give you a break.
Permalink
Bball3345Draft Pick
801 days ago
Score 1+-
If by consistent you mean narrow-minded... well, then no thanks.
Permalink
WoodsmeisterVarsity Captain
801 days ago
Score 0+-
I'm sorry, you are the narrow-minded one. You shot down every single stat I used to compare CC Sabathia to the rest of the field as irrelevent, and now you are changing your mind using another stat to discount all of the starters. I think there are several starters who are having standout, dominant seasons and are worthy of the award by most objective standards, including Beckett, Satbathia, Lackey, and Escobar. Yet, you continued to huddle on your little island of Ks and Runs Allowed and refuse to see the vast number of statistics by which pitchers can, objectively and reasonably be measured. Now, suddenly, you've leapfrogged to another island, using another statistic that very few people would consider even remotely relevent in comparing pitching performance. You can call that being openminded if you want. Evaluating pitching can be done by a variety of metrics, and your insistence that the only 2 important variables are RA and Ks is extremely narrowminded. This is the pot calling the kettle black, buddy.
Permalink
Bobbydigital04Varsity
801 days ago
Score 0+-
Peavy in the NL, Beckett in the AL. I agree.
Permalink | Reply
Kenrick ThomasVarsity Captain
797 days ago
Score 0+-
JAKE PEAVY IN THE N.L. AND THE A.L. IT'S OUT OF C.C.SABATHA OR JOSH BECKETT
Permalink | Reply
Add your Comment
ArmchairGM welcomes all comments. If you don't want to be anonymous, Register or Login. It's free


Retrieved from "http://armchairgm.wikia.com/Re-visiting_the_Cy_Young_award_talk"

This page was last modified 21:46, 17 September 2007. Content is available under the GFDL.

Contribute

ArmchairGM's pages can be edited.
Is this page incomplete? Is there anything wrong?
Change it!

Edit this page Discuss this page Page history

Recent contributors to this page

The following people recently contributed to this article.

Embed this on your site

Main Page About Special Pages Help Terms of Use Advertise