McNabb, You Are Out of Your Mind

even punters?

Last I checked, this is the United States, McNabb is an American and he is entitled to his opinion.

Go ahead and poll a few hundred African-Americans on the opinion of racial equality. Get back to us on the findings.

Peace.

Yeah, I don't see why a guy has to be great to have a valid opinion. There have been lots of great players with completely worthless opinions, and there have been some small-time players that are great thinkers. You don't have to be great to have a valid opinion, the same way being great doesn't make your opinion valid (yes, I am looking at you, Terry Bradshaw).

This is the most intelligent comment on this topic so far on ArmchairGM. ++++ to BigP.

Thx, I just feel people make this this too much of a black and white issue, meaning they make it too basic. McNabb has experienced more crap than almost any player who has entered the league. He has never done anything contravesial. Hell he is even knocked for being to basic and calm. This really is a guy who cannot win. If he had gone to any other city and any other team he would be a hero, but under the scruntiny of Philly fans and media he has been trounced since day one and its a shame.

Chicago welcomes Donovan with open arms.

*McNabb wasn't booed on draft day because he was black. He was booed because the fans (most notably former Mayor Ed Rendell) wanted Ricky Williams!@!!

Oh I know why he was booed, but nonetheless he cant control that he was black, and he cannot control that he was drafted instead of Ricky

I agree it's too much of a black and white issue. McNabb has dealt with alot, I won't deny I was one of those who thought it was a bad pick (I eat my words to this day).

I'll never say mcNabb did give his bets to us in his years here. I mean look at 02 I think it was. He played on a broken ankle and won. What more could you ask of him? A super Bowl? Yes, he's inconsistent, and is scared in the pocket, my only 2 issues with McNabb, but this guy, has NEVER (except T.O. who doesnt count:P) had a viable #1 option. He's a top flight QB with a squad of #2 and #3 WRs.

This needs to stop being made out to a race issue, it's more of an issue he has with Philly fans. I agree with him, my fellow fans are very hard on him, we're starved to win. That may not be a good excuse but, we need one, and want one bad, a Super Bowl.

McNabb has never dealt with Criticism well. He needs to take it all in stride, and let his play silence the critics.

HE has been very quiet for a long time. However the critics in Philly are relentless. They never stop. When he gave his all it wasnt enough, and as soon as someone else comes in and does the exact same thing he did, everyone throws a fit and celebrates like they are a Gods gift to football.

I've watched the eagle smy whole life. i know what you mean, but these philly critics, if you don't say anything and just play and ignore them. They have nothing to write on you other than your play. If what you do, say 34-40 325 yards and 3 TDs no INTs isn't enough for them, but your team STILL WON, there's your gratification. You won, they nitpick.

I like McNabb, he's a class act, a nice guy, and has given his all. I've only criticized him a few times, and rightfully so. THis year my biggets issue was him rushing back to play when he isn't fully healthy. He's scared to get his knee hit again. If that's so, sit down, let feeley play until you're ready. He's not going to lose his job based on injury, and if he does, this managment is crazy.

Again, sorry for typos, no glasses.

You don't think Donovan McNabb has already "overcome adversity"?

Everytime he does, he has to have a chip on his shoulder... not one that was put on his shoulder, usually one his puts there himself, or his Mom helps get there. He's got the same problem Gilbert Arenas has, he wasn't sympathy for reasons that don't deserve sympathy. He's a black QB, no one really cares anymore, and those who do care aren't relevant. So does Donovan McNabb listen to irrelevant people? Or does his make problems about of irrelvant issues? It's your call.

Daunte Culpepper came into the league at the same time, has seem about (remember I said about, not the same) the same amount of success as Donovan, yet I've never heard him have these complaints, the last two Black QBs who had a real legimate problem with these issues Donovan speaks on were Randall Cunningham and Doug Willams.

You seem to care enough to label McNabb a "black" QB rather than just a QB.

I also care enough about him and my race to not mis-label him African-American, we can debate this day and night Tyrone, espcially as two black men in the sports world.

So you prefer your quarterbacks acting like idiots off the field (ahem "Love Boat") rather than expressing a point of view?

Finally, let's debate.

I say Donovan has every damn right to express his point of view because this is America and he has the right to free speech.

Go ahead and argue that.

I don't have all night. That it?

And Tyrone I'm not saying that this issue has never been a problem, it was a problem for a long time. Black QB is just an issue I don't believe is a problem in sports, it's more a crutch for Black QBs to fall back on against critisim. Jake Plummer was basically ran out of Denver, was it cause he was a white QB? No, were the critisms in the Rocky Mountain New because he was a White QB? No, it was all beacuse he wasn't doing a good enough job, same with Joey Harrington in Detorit or Eli Manning in New York. Quarterbacks are rated and judged on their preformance these days, there are too many situations where Racsim still festers and thrives in our country and we are worried about this subject Donovan McNabb? No he is making it an issue cause he hasn't fully recovered form the knee injury and needs the race card to fall back on. See through the fog Tyrone, let's focus on real issues of race together, instead of being divded by a man who wants the color of his skin to be the topic of disucssion to take away from the discussion on how he's moving in the pocket.

...and just because he has an opinion, and I agree he can always... ALWAYS express his opinion, doesn't mean it's an opinion that holds weight against the reality of the situation

This is absolute garbage. See through the fog? Are you kidding me? Donovan McNabb has been treated at times like absolute crap by Philadelphia. Why was he booed on Draft Day? Why was he attacked by Rush Limbaugh on national television? This guy has tried to play with injuries other players would not even attempt to try. Many of today's QBs would not be in the NFL if it were not for guys like Donovan McNabb.

You attitude is deplorable. It is reminiscent to those who once thought Ali should "just shut up", be drafted into the army and not stand up for what he believed in.

Shame on you.

I would say Donovan McNabb has a better understanding of the realities of being a QB in the NFL than you ever will.

He speaks from experience.

You speak from a politically correct high school history book.

I won't continue this pissing contest with you while your on your pedstal so i'll deal with it in my blog, fell free to call it "deplorable" and along lines with "Ali being told to shut up and join the army" and "outta my high school history book" You can continue to hold on to race issues in football that have gone away. I'll worry about real race issues like why MS13 gang members gun down innocent blacks and target them for violence in the San Fernando Valley, or how the Mexican Illgal Immigrants bastardize our Civil Rights Movement to try to push their own agendas, but you know Tyrone, I want to deal with actually issues.

6 black QBs is not 1/3 of the league

sorry I was still counting, Vick, Leftwhich and Culpepper as starters which would bring us to 9. McNabb, T. Jackson, McNair, Garrard, Campbell, Young, Culpeeper, Leftwhich, and Vick was 9, 9/32 = 28% and i was rounding up to 30% sorry about that

Sorry had to be the knit picker. However out of that list of six lets be honest. Jackson is expected to fail and not considered a legit starter by most. Young is exactly that young and no one knows what you have with him. Garrad most dont think he should be a starter and he could easily be out of a job in a few short seasons or weeks. So you really have 4 or 5 legit starters

Don't know about that argument, BigP. There are plenty of white QB who have a tenuous hold on their starting QB job as well. Plus, I think you are underrating a couple of them, starting with VY.

Oh no you are correct I would probably say 10-12 QBs in the NFL are on a very short leash. I think VY is a warrior there is no doubt about that, but Im not sure if he has what it takes to become an eliete.

"You can continue to hold on to race issues in football that have gone away." You sure about that?

lol...his statement wasn't borderline racist. His statement was absolutely, obviously racist, without equivocation. And ESPN knew he'd made racist statements when they hired him, because he makes them ALL THE TIME. Their feaux shock was an insult. They brought him in to say controversial stuff to up their ratings, then acted like they were offended when he did just what he's been doing for over 20 years.

"No, it was all beacuse he wasn't doing a good enough job, same with Joey Harrington in Detorit or Eli Manning in New York."

But, as with the comparison our author here tried to make with Michael Vick, those guys never led their team to multiple conference championships, let alone a Super Bowl. McNabb has. Please, if you're going to try and use comparisons, come up with a valid one. Does anyone have an example of a white QB who has been maligned as a weak, lazy underachiever despite multiple playoff victories and a Super Bowl appearance?

Exactly I think that its a combination of everything McNabb has experienced in the lst 9 years. He is under far more pressure than any other black QB and most other QBs black or white for that matter.

Vick got a free pass while he was playing because he was a highlight reel and could do anything with his feet.

McNair got the pass because he was a warrior who played through his injuries even though his play on the field suffered at times.

Leftwich got a pass because he was young and he played on a Jacksonville team that was always considered on the cusp, and the Jacksonville fans only have a small interest in their team.

Culpeper got a pass because he had Moss and had success with that, but he was starting to feel the heat and ultimitly a torn ACL got him out of the spotlight and out of a starting job.

Thats the roundup of the eliete black QBs none of them have the environment that McNabb has. The intensity under the Philly microscope will crack anyone black or white.

Doug Williams has always been one of my sports idols/heors, and that lil story just backed up every reason I ever liked him, poise, class, composure and a likeable personality.

The Dough Williams story is amazing but that amazing season he had in Washington is almost a blip on the map when compared horrid years that sandwiched it on either side.

And as much as I hate to say this, if Aaron Brooks were white he never would have taken a snap in the NFL, so what's your point?

Kordell Stewart was not given a short leash. He had two horrid seasons and then got injured. While he was out former insurance saleman Tommy Maddox lit up the score boards and ended up with the starting position. He was offered his old role and wouldn't accept it. He stunk. One good year doesn't earn you a permenant starting role you need to keep winning not whining. He lost his job fair and square.

Kordell Stewart has come back in mor ereincarnations than he ever deserved. He was a gimmick QB who made his career based off one lucky long TD in college.

he had the interview before the season started, actually

He's a good quarterback, but I wouldn't say he's excellent. But regardless, it's ridiculous to say he shouldn't be scrutinized. All players can and should be scrutinized. They gain fame and make a great deal of money playing a game for a living. If he isn't willing to put up with scrutiny, then he can quit and get a job where he's anonymous and making crappy money like the rest of us. Sorry, maybe black quarterbacks have it harder than white quarterbacks, but they have it easier than the rest of us.

However, I do think his complaint has some merit, just not in the way he thinks. Black quarterbacks do face pressures that white quarterbacks do not. However, that has nothing to do with racism or anything like that. Simply put, black quarterbacks are icons to the black community in ways that white quarterbacks are not to the white community. White people might root for Peyton Manning, but not because he's white.

Second, black quarterbacks do tend to be judged differently as quarterbacks. They seem to be judged by their "athleticism" rather than their ability at quarterback. And usually by "athleticism" they mean speed and elusiveness. This starts in college where the "athleticism" of a quarterback is a much bigger factor than it is in the pros. White quarterbacks tend to be judged on how much they possess traditional quarterbacking skills, like accuracy, field vision, quick decision-making, etc. This is why quarterbacks like Michael Vick and Vince Young are often considered to be elite quarterbacks despite possessing completion rates that rival back-up quarterbacks on other teams. Remember Kordell Stewart? The dude was considered one of the elite, top-five quarterbacks in the league for a few years. Up there with guys like Favre. He was overrated from day one. The idea that he was ever at the level of someone like Favre is laughable today. Would a white quarterback with Stewart's level of ability ever get treated that way? Of course not. So, it cuts both ways. Black quarterbacks get cut slack in ways that white quarterbacks do not (if a white quarterback put up stats like Michael Vick, would he treated as one of the elite quarterbacks in the league? Of course not. In fact, there are several white quarterbacks who put up similar or better numbers than Vick, and are considered average to slightly above average; see Green, Trent, for one example).

So, in conclusion: Do McNabb's comments have merit? I suppose, but mostly I just think he needs to get over himself and play football. Once you're on the field, no one cares what color you are, just what color you're wearing.

Maybe he could if he had half the recievers those guys have.

Can you explain to me what it is exactly that Palmer, Brees, or Bulger has accomplished?

Seriously he is already light years ahead of Palmer Brees and Bulger for acomplishments.

Palmer 1 play appereance lasted 5 mins.

Bulger 1 Super Bowl Appereance? maybe if so a lost to the Pats and I think 1 NFC conference title appearence and a lost to the Panthers.

Brees= Marty Ball so you can guess what he has done in his playoff career.

Warner was still quaterback of the Rams when they lost to the Pats, Bulger has never been past the second round.

I love how I am getting minused for saying McNabb looks like a horse. It was supposed to be funny, and has nothing to do with race just the fact that his head is shaped like a horse. I'm a Cowboys fan, do you really expect me to like the guy???

Im a Cowboys fan and I have no problem with the guy

"instance where a white QB had put up such great numbers and still been called overrated" - Peyton Manning?????

I never heard anyone with half a brain call Manning overrated. They said he couldn't win the big one, but he was breaking records left and right and leading his team to tons of regular season wins and getting great berths in the playoffs...people criticized him, but it felt different. It didn't come from a place of hate, because people still loved Manning and how great he was. They just complained that he couldn't win the big one. His job was still never in jeopardy. Not like the people in Philly calling for Garcia last year.

I didn't realize there was a "half a brain" qualifier... =)

The question isn't if Black QBs face struggles, of course they do man. The question is if Black QBs are put under greater pressure or if they are critized more based on the fact that they are Black, no other reason. McNabb and other black QBs have been critized and have had heaps of pressure put on them in recent years for their different reasons, but not because they are Black; at least that's what I thought this conversation was about and that's what my side of it has been based on. Again I stand by this positon:

Black quarterbacks do not face more pressure or critisim based on their skin being black in this current day and age.

I continue to hear all these arguements from other writers here both black and not, but no one has been able to show me real proof that Donovan McNabb or any other black quarterback since Donovan entered the league that proves my above statement wrong.

And Tyrone if you read this, your calling Shame on Me yesterday was sad, your arguement holds less weight then Nicole Richie and your calling shame on me? whatever, I already said I'll deal with it later.

I thought I'd presented my argument clearly. I guess not. I'll ask again - do you have an example of a white QB in the last 10 years that has been called underrated or whose job has truly been in jeopardy even though he had led his team to multiple conference championships and a Super Bowl, like McNabb has? Do you have an example of a white QB that's been called too stupid to run an NFL offense, as Vince Young has? If you can find a white QB that's had to deal with significant criticism that's just as stupid, I'll concede your point. Until then, I maintain that black QBs have faced more pressure, especially in the form of undue and preposterous criticism.

Quarterbacks are overrrated! Terry "Box of Rocks" Bradshaw won 4 Super Bowls for cripesake!!!

Two words (say 'em with me): Trent Dilfer

And when was Leaf taken #1? In the supplemental draft after Peyton went? =)

Now there, I can agree. You don't NEED a great QB to win. And Trent Dilfer played his Super Bowl against Kerry Collins. You don't need a great QB to win. However, is anyone going to argue that the Eagles succeeded DESPITE McNabb? I don't think this is a Trent Dilfer situation. Dilfer never put up numbers like McNabb's.

Ok, you got me with Kerry Collins being the other QB. So I present to you, Mr. Smarty Pants - Mark Rypien, Jay Schroeder and Brad Johnson!

I was gonna say Brad Johnson, but I restrained myself. But, you definitely got me there. You win!