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About the Author

LouGehrig
I have been a Yankees fan for many years. Thanks to what has occurred during the last few years, I am beginning to wonder.

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Buehrle: NOT a Hall of Famer

by LouGehrig
created July 27, 2009, last edited July 29, 2009
11
Vote

by Harold Friend

Mark Buehrle is in his tenth major league season. He joined the Chicago White Sox in 2000, at the age of 21, and pitched only 51 1/3 innings, compiling a 4-1 record, with a 4.21 ERA and a 119 ERA+. Since then, Buehrle has never pitched less than 201 innings in a season. For the last few weeks, there have been discussions with respect to Buehrle's chances of eventually being elected to the Hall of Fame. Those discussions intensified after Mark Buehrle pitched a perfect game.

Mark Buehrle is not a Hall of Famer

If Mark Buehrle's future career replicates his past seasons, he does not belong in the Hall of Fame. He is a fine pitcher, but despite two no-hitters, he is an efficient, not a dominating pitcher.

Pitchers Similar to Mark Buehrle

Baseball-Reference lists Johnny Podres, Ross Grimsley, Frank Viola, Tom Glavine, Mike Hampton, Barry Zito, and Jerry Reuss as similar left-handers through age 29. Only Tom Glavine will ever be a Hall of Famer, primarily because of his 305 wins and long career.

Lefty Gomez, Hal Newhouser, and Herb Pennock

Three Hall of Fame pitchers whose credentials have been questioned include, but are not limited to, Lefty Gomez, Hal Newhouser, and Herb Pennock. All had outstanding seasons, but none was of the caliber of Lefty Grove, Randy Johnson, or Sandy Koufax (whose brief career is often an issue).

Similar Statistics

Mark Buehrle will probably win more than 200 games, since he was 30 years old in March and should have at least five or six more productive years. Although Buehrle's ERA is higher than that of Gomez, Newhouser, and Pennock, his ERA+, which accounts for the league's ERA, is better than that of the others.

Buehrle's WHIP (Walks and Hits/Innings Pitched) is clearly superior.. He gives up fewer walks, and has a much better strikeout to walk ratio than any of the others.

Twenty Win Seasons

Lefty Gomez won at least 20 games in a season twice. In 1934, he was 26-5, and in 1937, he was 21-11. He led the league in ERA twice, each time with a 2.33 mark.

Hal Newhouser won 29 games in 1944, 25 games in 1945, and 26 games in 1946. Those three outstanding seasons, plus a 21 win season in 1948, resulted in Newhouser making the Hall of Fame. He was the American League's Most Valuable Player in both 1944 and 1945, which is almost unheard of for a pitcher, but like Sandy Koufax, he had only five great seasons.

Herb Pennock won at least 20 games only twice in a career that spanned 22 seasons. Pennock was good, he was consistent, but he never dominated. He pitched in five World Series, and compiled a 5-0 record.

Mark Buehrle Has Never Won 20 Games in a Season

Mark Buehrle has never won 20 games in a season, but he pitches in an era where starters rarely pitch more than seven innings. He averages 15 wins a season, compared to Lefty Gomez' 19 wins a season, Hal Newhouser's 16 wins a season, and Herb Pennock's 16 wins a season. Buehrle has led the league in games started and innings pitched twice, but he has never led in any major categories.

Mediocre Pitchers Have Pitched Perfect Games

Of course, he has pitched two no-hitters, one of which was a perfect game, but such feats are not always accomplished by great pitchers. Don Larsen pitched the only perfect World Series game, Bobo Holloman pitched a no-hitter in his first major league game, and Kenny Rogers and Mike Witt have pitched regular season perfect games.

Sandy Koufax and Randy Johnson Dominated

Sandy Koufax and Randy Johnson were dominant pitchers who rank among the greatest. Mark Buehrle is a solid, reliable pitcher, who, except for two occasions, is quite hittable. Koufax pitched four no-hitters, including a perfect game, while Johnson has pitched two no-hitters, including a perfect game.

Koufax' career ended when he was 30 years old, which is Buerhle's age. Koufax won more games, lost fewer games, had an ERA that was one full run a game lower, and even when using ERA+, still topped Buehrle. Buehrle allows about two more hits every nine innings compared to Koufax. The comparisons of Buehrle with Johnson are similar.

Get Them Out of the Hall of Fame

There is no question that Buehrle compares favorably to Lefty Gomez, Hal Newhouser, and Herb Pennock, and that none of the three, like Buehrle, can stand up to Koufax or Johnson. The question is not whether Buehrle get into the Hall of Fame. The question is how to get Gomez, Newhouser, and Pennock out. Keep dreaming.

Reference:

Baseball-Reference


Enable Comment Auto-Refresher
CheezerAll-Star
124 days ago
Score 0+-
Yeah, I don't think you'll get much disagreement here. Even I think he's is lacking the qualifications for the Hall of Fame.
Permalink | Reply
Sj-hypocycloidAll-American
124 days ago
Score 1+-
I have also often thought that there are a few folks that should be withdrawn from the HOF. But that wouldn't be nice, would it? I guess once you're in, you're in...
Permalink
RawbeezeitzMajor Leaguer
124 days ago
Score 1+-
If there were some sort of withdrawal process, then selection would lose its luster.
Permalink
RawbeezeitzMajor Leaguer
124 days ago
Score 4+-
Arguing that Buehrle doesn't belong in Cooperstown because he's not as good as Koufax or Johnson is like saying Rickey Henderson doesn't belong cuz he's not as good as Cobb or Mays.


Comparing 20 win seasons between a pitcher from the 2000s and guys from the 1930s is a waste of time. Totally different eras.


But overall, you're right, Buehrle doesn't seem to be destined to be a HOFer. He has some bonuses going for him: the no-hitter, a WS ring, lots of innings. But he has no Cy Youngs, only 4 All-Star Games, and only once was in Cy Young voting, finishing 5th.


He does have an outside chance at 300 wins. If he averages 15 for 11 seasons, he'll surpass 300. It's a tall task. But it's not out of the question that he'll win 17 or 18 for the next few years, then be capable of winning 12 or 13 a season for years to come. But that's a longshot, and it might be his only shot.
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JuTMSY4Legend
124 days ago
Score 3+-
on the same page Rawb...
Permalink
JuTMSY4Legend
124 days ago
Score 4+-
Ugh...

Koufax pitched 11 years, Buehrle's working on his 9th...and he didn't start till 2001.

A lot of times, we're quick (Read: ESPN) to anoint someone as the greatest ever or an immediate HoFer and it is stupid. That being said, let's at least let him finish his body of work before we make any call.

300 wins is like 500 homers in that 500 homers is now a very unspecial number whereas 300 is particularly special (and more & more difficult to achieve). Then again, Jamie Moyer seems like he could hit 300...does he belong in the Hall of Fame?

I enjoy how you cherrypick facts to suggest Buehrle doesn't fit the mold (like the Koufax comparison).

I'm not saying he belongs or is even all that close, but you're not making a very good case as to why not.
Permalink | Reply
LouGehrigRed-Shirting
124 days ago
Score -3+-
Yes, I am.
Permalink
RawbeezeitzMajor Leaguer
124 days ago
Score 2+-
Permalink
JuTMSY4Legend
124 days ago
Score 4+-
Jamie Moyer has more wins then 27 Hall of Fame pitchers...he deserves to be in the hall of fame
Permalink
LouGehrigRed-Shirting
124 days ago
Score 0+-
Is there anyone in her right mind who would select Moyer as her starting pitcher in a must-win game?
Permalink | Reply
SSreportersLegend
124 days ago
Score 4+-
I don't know. Why don't you ask her?
Permalink
JuTMSY4Legend
124 days ago
Score 3+-
Ty Cobb doesn't belong in the hall of fame: he's only 589th on the all time home run list...just ahead of Brandon Inge Or maybe Inge belongs in the HoF...I'm not sure
Permalink
LouGehrigRed-Shirting
123 days ago
Score 0+-
I can't ask her because she divorced me. Yes, Brandon Inge belongs in the Hall of Fame. Certainly, he belongs in the Tigers' Hall of Fame, along with Freddie Hatfield, who was called "Scrap Iron."
Permalink | Reply
PmoehrinVarsity
122 days ago
Score 1+-
The way pitching has changed in the last 20 years or so it's almost impossible I've found it to compare players across era's simply because of the difference in innings pitched.

I may have a solution to it, but it's taken me a while to come up with one even if it works.

Is Mark Buehrle a Hall of Famer? At this point probably not, but I don't know if he has a chance to become one simply because I don't know what the qualifications for what a Hall of Fame pitcher will be in 15-20 years from now.

Will 200 wins really be enough to lock you in? Maybe and then again maybe not.
Permalink | Reply
CoryMcKnightSoccer Kid
122 days ago
Score 0+-
Buehrle is only 29 and we are talking about his Hall of Fame credentials? Seriously? The guy will probably pitch into his 40s due to his skill set. I think the guy has an outside shot to get to 300 wins and Ive said that for the last few years. If he gets there, he is a shoe-in.
Permalink | Reply
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Categories: Opinions | Opinions by User LouGehrig | July 27, 2009 | July 2009 | MLB Opinions | Mark Buehrle Opinions | Hall of Fame Opinions | Randy Johnson Opinions | Sandy Koufax Opinions | Lefty Gomez Opinions | Hal Newhouser Opinions | Herb Pennock Opinions

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