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AGMVC : Pujols is king, but who's tops at second?

13
Vote

by user Steaksammich

The voting for first basemen fell off the main page pretty quick, so we didn't get as many voters as I would have liked, but we did manage to match the 8 that we got for catchers.

Albert Pujols was the obvious and unanimous choice for the best active firstbasemen, but the rest of the list was all over the place. Mark Teixeira, who came in second, was voted as high as 2nd and as low as 7th. Two voters put Carlos Delgado as high as second, but one voter didn't think that he was even worthy of being in the top ten. Paul Konerko got a 2nd place vote, but he also got two 10th place votes. Todd Helton was ranked as high as third, but he didn't even make it onto 4 ballots. And Ben Broussard is actually worthy of a top ten vote in the eyes of one voter.

The full results can be found here.

And now, following the pattern, it's time to vote for the top ten active second basemen. You can do so, here.

While the AGMVC puts in their vote for the active guys, let's take a look at the top ten second basemen of all time.

1. Eddie Collins - Collins's numbers don't look as good as Hornsby's, but when you take a look at the context, they are just as good and maybe even better. Collins's career was winding down when offenses exploded in the 1920's while Hornsby's was just about to begin. He also had better defense and a better attitude than Hornsby. He had an OBP of at least .400 in 17 of the 19 years that he was a regular player.

2. Rogers Hornsby - He has more home runs than any other second baseman in the history of the game other than Jeff Kent. He won the triple crown twice and hit at least .370 eight times (3 times he hit .400 or more). He's known as one of the biggest jerks to ever play the game, but he's also one of the best hitters.

3. Joe Morgan - He may not be a smart broadcaster or columnist, but he was a smart player who had great spead and good power for a middle infielder. Over the course of his career he walked 850 more times than he struck out. Add in his great defense and you have a player with no real weaknesses.

4. Nap Lajoie - The guy was so good that in 1903 the Cleveland team changed their name to the Naps, in his honor. His name is all over the all-time career leaderboards. He gets bonus points for being from Woonsocket, RI, my home town.

5. Jackie Robinson - He's mentioned so often for breaking the color barrier that sometimes it's easy to forget that he was such a great ballplayer. He played in just 10 seasons, but he was very good defensively no matter where he was playing, had speed, a good eye, good contact, and moderate power. He was a great all-around player.

6. Roberto Alomar - His career nosedived after the 2001 season, but he put together a lot of excellent seasons before he turned 34. He had great speed, decent power, and a glove that we saw on the highlite reels nearly every night. Even with his mediocre seasons at the end of his career, he finished with a career .300 AVG.

7. Jeff Kent - He is the best power hitting second baseman of all-time. Only Roger Hornsby has a higher SLG. He's a legimate middle-of-the-order threat and his defense is better than many give him credit for, but compared to the first six on this list, his AVG and OBP are low and his defense, while decent, isn't great.

8. Craig Biggio - Bill James calls him the 5th best second baseman and the 35th greatest player of all-time because of his ability to do all the little things. The things he really excelled at (getting hit by pitches and not grounding in to double players) didn't show up in the boxscores, but over the course of the season they really helped his value. I don't know if I'd go as far as to call him the 35th greatest player of all-time, but he is a very good player and one of the more underrated ones of our time.

9. Ryne Sandberg - Power, speed, and defense, this guy had it all. Only Roberto Alomar has more Gold Gloves at second than this Cubs legend.

10. Charlie Gehringer - He hit for a great AVG, stole bases, and had a little bit of power. His final game was nearly 40 years before I was born, so I obviously never got to see him field, but he has a good defensive reputation.


Date

Fri 05/26/06, 7:58 am EST

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Awrigh01All-Star
1265 days ago
Score 1+-
Joe Morgan drives me crazy. I know its irrational, but I can't put him at #3 because of his moronic broadcasting.
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SteaksammichRed-Shirting
1265 days ago
Score 2+-
I never saw him play so I know him only as a broadcaster. I tried not to let that affect my judgement of the guy. From what I hear he was great and the numbers speak for himself. But, yeah....what an idiot
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DNLLegend
1265 days ago
Score 1+-
Oof, Hornsby's gotta be #1.
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SteaksammichRed-Shirting
1265 days ago
Score 1+-
I planned on having Hornsby first. He seems like the obvious choice. But Bill James talked me out of it in his historical abstract. He compared the 1909 season for Collins to the 1929 season for Hornsby. Collins had 118 runs created that year, but the average team was scoring just 3.44 runs per game. Hornsby created 178 runs in '29, but the average team was scoring 5.36 runs a game at that time.



I think you're probably right though. Two Triple Crowns and 3 .400 averages is too much to ignore
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Awrigh01All-Star
1265 days ago
Score 1+-
Reading this list, its amazing how few dominant 2B there have been in the majors. I wonder how guys like Chase Utley will fair when all is said and done. Would Alfonso Soriano be included on this list, if he moves to the OF?
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SteaksammichRed-Shirting
1265 days ago
Score 2+-
Utley's already 27, but if he can keep his production up until his mid-30's then he could easily finish his career with Jeff Kent-like production and make the top ten list. For Soriano, I think it just matters how many games he ends up playing in the outfield. I don't know how others thnk about it, but in his book, Bill James considered a guy at the position where he played the most games in his career.
Permalink | Reply
DarrelSoccer Kid
1265 days ago
Score 0+-
Joe Morgan's #1 baby.
Permalink | Reply
Davis21wylieMVP
1265 days ago
Score 1+-
Didn't Bill James rank Morgan first in the Historical Abstract?
Permalink | Reply
Bball3345Draft Pick
1265 days ago
Score 2+-
Yes he did, but he said Collins and Hornsby were incredibly close. Then, it dropped off a bit.
Permalink | Reply
SteaksammichRed-Shirting
1265 days ago
Score 0+-
Like Bball said, Bill James did rank Morgan first and said the top 3 were very close. He gave the nod to Morgan because he was a very smart ballplayer...but I just couldn't see him as number one over the other two.
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This page was last modified 00:55, 30 May 2006. Content is available under the GFDL.

Categories: Opinions | AGMVC | MLB Opinions | Second base Opinions | First base Opinions | Charlie Gehringer Opinions | Ryne Sandberg Opinions | Craig Biggio Opinions | Jeff Kent Opinions | Roberto Alomar Opinions | Jackie Robinson Opinions | Nap Lajoie Opinions | Joe Morgan Opinions | Rogers Hornsby Opinions | Eddie Collins Opinions | May 26, 2006 | Opinions by User Steaksammich

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